or faster relief, try dulcolax laxative tablets. dulcolax provides gentle relief overnight unlike miralax and metamucil that can take up to 3 days. for predictable relief try dulcolax. >> geraldo: this is a fox news alert. i'm geraldo rivera reporting that despite the trio of scandals swirling around his white house, the president played golf again today for the 122nd time which the question is he too cool for school? or simply tone deaf? >> therefore, i shall resign the presidency effective at noon tomorrow. >> geraldo: this is not watergate but it as troubling trifecta of controversies that threaten to cripple mr. obama's second term agenda. >> my question is who is going to jail over the scandal? >> geraldo: the targeting of the irs by the tea party and

other conservatives. >> was the irs using inappropriate criteria in its review of organizations applying for tax exempt status? yes. was the irs delaying their applications? yes, and finally, did the irs ask unnecessary and inappropriate questions of applicants. again, yes. >> it was inadvertent. just some odd underlings out of cincinnati that did this and there was no political motive whatever involved. the question is how stupid do they think we are? >> geraldo: stupid or crafty, the second scandal plaguing the administration is still the spin the state department put on benghazi. >> ongoing obsession with talking points and benghazi and the attempts to politicize that. constitute a side show driven purely by or largely by political interests. >> the fact that the state department was intimately

involved in this and they were taking out factual information because they were worried about the political ramifications of that, i think that is a pretty important point. >> geraldo: and perhaps the most important point or at least the scandal closest to home for working reporters the aggressive crackdown on a cia leak published by the associated press. and why do we reporters care so much? >> i'm not calling that reporter back because their phone might tapped. my number might show up on their records because the justice department has shown that they are willing to do that. >> geraldo: in the administration defense? >> this is among if not the most serious it is the top two or three most serious leaks that i have ever seen that put the american people at risk and that is not hyperbole. put the american people at risk and trying to determine who is responsible for that i think required very aggressive action. >> geraldo: he is demanding that the president of the united states demand the immediate resignation of the

attorney general eric holder. reince priebus, the chairman of the republican national committee. great to see you. tell me why you want eric holder to resign? >> i think this is another chanter in a pretty i think terrible tenure as attorney general. i mean everything from things i haven't agreed with and called the attorney general out on like reading miranda rights to the christmas day bomber. claiming he wanted to read the legal rights over the dead body of osama bin laden. his living legacy as he said it would be to try all 9/11 terrorists in civilian court. fast and furious. we have got a contempt of congress that passed with 17 democrats agreeing to it. now, we have got this ap situation this unbelievable subpoena power that he now claims he recused himself with. he claims that this leak that they were investigating is the the biggest leak he has seen in

his entire career and put people at risk. yet the president doesn't know anything about it, geraldo. isn't that something? that this huge leak that put americans at risk as hems, the president knows nothing about it. the whole book and whole chapter is lousy with eric holder and i think he needs to go. >> geraldo: first of all, in terms of the ap leak, his position is he followed the law whether it was the patriot act or subpoena that what he did was lawful, however, not just we in the media might think it was. >> whether it was lawful or not, obviously it was extraordinary in its cope scope. i think everyone agrees with that. he didn't even -- usually subpoenau issue a sub pee he sometimes you go in and say to the ap look we need to investigate these calls that were going on. we don't need to actually tap the house phone that members of congress use with reporters but we do want to get to some of

the calls that took place. here is what we want. can you work with us on it? not with this guy. they went on a mission and then he recused himself from the entire thing. he said well, i speak to ap reporters so therefore i have to recuse myself. all to convenient with this attorney general when you add it up from the beginning to the end and all of the other scandals involved he hasn't been good for this country. >> geraldo: do you think it is unreasonable or are i guess unrealistic to believe the president did not know what was going on? the president i'm talking about, not the attorney general. >> this is where the focus should be. how do we have a president that doesn't know anything about this irs scandal? in fact, the key there is really the press conference this nonanswer from barack obama when was asked if any one in the white house knew anything about this irs

targeting. he said well, i didn't see the ig report until after it was issue. >> i can assure you that i certainly did not know anything about the ig report before the ig report had been leaked through press -- through the press. >> wait a second. did you just admit that in fact someone knew about it in the white house or you just didn't answer the question? didn't know anything about that even though the counsel and the white house had the report. didn't know anything about this leak even though it was apparently the biggest leak of eric holder's lifetime and career. and benghazi we didn't know it was an act of terrorism even though now we know that the white house had access to e-mails going back and forth showing that the cia in fact called it a terrorist act and we were just a few weeks out of an election. >> there is no speech that justifies mindless violence.

there are no words that excuse the killing of innocents. there is no video that justifies on attack on an embassy. >> also tough trying to get every single one of them wrong, too. >> geraldo: is there any indication yet that any one in the white house was aware of what the irs was doing vis-a-vis the tea party or other conservative groups? >> it would be unbelievable to think that not a sing isle person in the white house close to the president didn't know anything about this. the president has created, geraldo, an environment, a culture of guerilla warfare. he is obsessed with power and ego and hates dissent. he created this environment. who has created all of this? who has created this obsession with power and hatred for dissent in all of these scandals? it is the president. the fact it clearly it just so

happens that everyone targeted happens to be the people who have a problem with the direction of this country is going under this president. just so happens that the benghazi issue is stifled just before the election. i don't think too many people would say there isn't a guilty verdict coming. >> geraldo: do you want a special prosecutor? what forum do we hash this out and discover the truth? the real facts, the real circumstances? >> i think you would want to have a special counsel for sure into the irs issue. i think the members of congress have been doing a good job so far. i think what you are seeing after friday's hearings is that this is going to take a consist enter siftent intelligent effort and i think that is the way it has got to be. i think republicans and democrats discerning at least in the areas have to be patient but have to be persistent and just like many scandals of the past over time i think the

truth is going to come out. and i think that is what we have to do. >> geraldo: reince priebus, thank you very much, man. i appreciate it. >> thanks, geraldo. >> geraldo: we will break some news tonight on benghazi with the new whistle blower story of a security detachment in libya before the attacks but sent home over their objection. used a contractor before and didn't know where to start. at angie's list, you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. no company can pay to be on angie's list, so you can trust what you're reading. angie's list is like having thousands of close neighbors where i can go ask for personal recommendations. that's the idea. before you have any work done, check angie's list. from roofers to plumbers to dentists and more, angie's list -- reviews you can trust. i love you, angie. sorry, honey.

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this has become a huge story. the whole irs thing apparently targeting conservative groups like the tea he party. you know it is bad when president obama says hey, why don't we talk about some gazi? >> having fun. >> geraldo: the next guest a ceo group targeted by the clinton era offed irs. karrie is a coordinator of the tea party patriots and what

concerns her now is that sarah ingram who was in charge of tax exemptions during the time the tea party was targeted now as you have probably heard, ladies and gentlemen, heading up the irs office overseeing obamacare. ladies, welcome. why does ra sarah ingram's newb bother you so? >> the enforcement is going to come out of the irs. if the woman who was in charge while people were targeted for political ideologies and is now in charge of that portion of the irs, the obama care part of the irs how do we know that our sensitive health information is safe there? will it be exploited? will we be discriminated against again based on our health? these are life and death decisions, not just tax questions. >> geraldo: you are fearful she would breech the most basic confidences and use your health information for political purposes as well? >> she was in charge. i don't know if she personally did it or not at the irs but

she was in charge and if she is in charge again how you do we know. there is no possible way to know or to trust this woman. to know that she is not going to be in charge of another breech of confidence and confidential information. it is very serious. >> geraldo: and penny nance, your basic position is that this has been going on in democratic administrations since the '90s? >> absolutely. concerned women for america has a 501 c 3 and c4. from 1993 to 2000 my organization was targeted and harassed. the same kind of similar story. amazing, geraldo, none of us knew that any of this is going on. everyone kept all of this private and now all the stories are coming out. there has been widespread abuse going on within the irs now for are decades. and i sincerely hope that congress and the department of justice will go back and look

for back into the '90s at the heavy handed overreach of the irs and the harassment of conservatives. you know, i frankly believe that this is criminal. i believe that they have violated 18 usc 241 and 242 which is con spea conspiracy te people of their civil rights. it is is view point discrimination and it is criminal. i hope that doj does their job. >> geraldo: what you believe, penny, is that they have done this for a generation now. >> yes. >> geraldo: what about the charge that during the bushed a a menstruation it was thadam j- during the bush administration it was the naacp and other groups that were targeted. >> it is wrong no matter who does it. view point discrimination is wrong. the government under the color of law harassing private

citizens based on viewpoint is wrong and even criminal. >> geraldo. >> geraldo: go ahead. >> we have hundreds of groups coming forward. my group tea party patriots was affected. we were victimized and discriminated against. these are people who have over the 40s of three or four years have only brought in $1,700. these are like mom and pop little organizations and they were targeted. and there are thousands of people who just decided to give up because they didn't want to go through the trouble of getting harassed or are giving out private information of their members list and donor lists and things like that. and to really the damage is come meetly immeasurable. >> geraldo: and what about, kelly, this pointing out that steve miller the acting commissioner is out. they will undoubtedly discipline members of the crew in cincinnati that were evidently the hands on

perpetrators of this wrongdoing. is that enough for you? or do you think it goes higher than that, kelly? >> i believe it is far -- goes far are beyond in breadth and depth and possibly in height up through the administration or through the treasury department and i'm sorry but a guy who was going retire in a month anyways and going to get his full retirement. he is not punished for this at all. to he retires a month early. peggy noonen wrote today if this doesn't stop now it will never stop. the next president whether they be republican or democrat people will continue to be targeted and discriminated against by their government. we are talking about the first amendment of the constitution of a the united states. that right is -- we cannot allow this to happen. i get emotional about it you know i'm fighting for -- i'm 7 months pregnant and i'm fighting for my child's right

to freely speak when she wants to and particularly on political issues if you can't criticize your government where are we? >> geraldo: congratulations on the coming daughter i guess you have give ten away. so we will send you pink ribbons. be congratulations on that. we will continue to follow if you do file a lawsuit certainly we will report that but thank you, kelly and penny both for coming on. >> up next, a member of the oversight committee who oversight committee who believes crimes may have been [ thunder crashes ] [ female announcer ] some people like to pretend a flood could never happen to them. and that their homeowners insurance protects them. [ thunder crashes ] it doesn't. stop pretending. only flood insurance covers floods. ♪ visit floodsmart.gov/pretend to learn your risk.

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for a store near you go to benjaminmoore.com/bayarea. is the illegal what this he have done? >> it is absolutely not the illegal. >> it is not illegal what the irs has done? >> so let me he understand the question. what is -- what is your statement as to what is

illegal? >> do you believe it is illegal for are employees of the irs to create lists to target individual groups and citizens in this country? >> i think the treasury inspector general indicated that it might not be but others will be able to tell that. >> what do you believe? >> i don't believe it is. congressman fromext guest is orlando. welcome. tell my why if you can you suspect crimes were committed by the irs targeting of the tea party? >> we don't know for sure and that is what we will try to find out for sure on wednesday. we want to know against the information that was obtained, the harassment of individuals and organizations requesting -- going after people and auditing them who were named as possible be applicants. information, again, that was obtained and then possibly

misused. so we are going to look at every aspect and then we want to see how far up the chain of command people knew about what was going on. >> geraldo: i didn't mean to interrupt, congressman. with so much going on, the irs, benghazi, the ap probe, how do you know what to focus on? >> well, it as handful, i can assure you. we just got through with benghazi. i heard your leno clip and it was almost humorous that the president might want to go back to benghazi after the ap and cia story and now the treasury. we will find out wednesday. we a list of people, dave camp did a good job on friday with ways and means. the government reform and oversight. we will have the dipty secretary of treasury in and also shed ulman, miller who testified last week was there temporarily and he is exiting. they are trying to make a big

deal out of his stepping aside. not a big deal, he was going anyways. but we will have actually shulman who was the irs commissioner at the time. and then we willle have the famous lois lerner who was in charge of the tax exempt division at the time. we will have some of the principals and find out how high up they knew and when they knew what was going on and again we are looking to see if the law in fact was violated. >> geraldo: and you have a situation now where you have these hearings going forward. do you expect now that it is clear that some officials in the treasury department knew about what was going on in the irs? i mean how far are up that food chain do you expect to find evidence of knowledge of the targeting of the tea party and do you have any information whatsoever what it leaps across the street from treasury to the white house? >> well, i don't know, geraldo. but some of this does smell of

it. you have got -- we are calling in the noninfamous sarah hall ingram. she was on the scene and then elevated to now she is going to or she has been leading i don't know if it was a reward or whatever for what she did but we will find that out, too. she will head up the irs division over obamacare. and there is going to be -- that is the enforcement agency. stop and think about that if you want to lose some sleep tonight. they will be the enforcers of obamacare. estimated 15 to 16,000 investigators people who have your personal information now your medical information and this woman who again started some of this and we will find she will be brought in i think at another point. but we are going to go through this very meticulously and we want to search out o the ground the facts. you don't want to make any allegations and then the

whole -- >> geraldo: give me he 30 seconds. >> , my libertarian republican friends say i don't want any of these groups right or left to be tax exempt. why aren't they paying taxes. moveon.org. the media matters and the tea party. why don't they all pay taxes right and left? >> well, again, the courts have held that everybody has the right to free speech and organizations, too. and sort of like a tax on free speech. they apply and have to meet certain qualifications and then they are tax exempt. so it is a touchy one under, you know, the -- >> geraldo: i have to leave you

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this is a fox news weather alert. i'm marianne rafferty in new york. we are following a dangerous situation brewing across the midwest. reports of large tornado has touched down in roselle, kansas. no word on damage or injuries. kansas along with oklahoma, nebraska and parts of texas, missouri, south dakota and minnesota are all bracing for possible hail, damaging winds and tornadoes. the threat could last three days. meanwhile, dozens injured after an out of control car plows into a crowd at a parade in damascus, virginia. the car appeared to come from a side street and slam inside several bystanders injuries the driver described as an elderly man may have suffered a medical emergency before the crash.

no triple crown winner this year. orb finishing third in the preakness. oxbow won the race held at pimlico course in baltimore. i'm marianne rafferty. now, back to "geraldo at large." >> geraldo: what about the events that night? are you convinced that we did everything we possibly could as the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff and other military officials today maintain or do you wish we had tried and done more? >> we now have confirmed the talking points were just totally incorrect. we would you now confirmed it was an organized attack against the mission and later against the cia head quarters. we he confirmed there were requests for additional security that weren't granted. we need to know the who, what, when, where and why. >> the only edits were stylistics and not substantive. they corrected the facility and

the like. >> there is nobody at this point that believed the white house spokes person these were merely stylistic changes. the public was misled for weeks. >> geraldo: benghazi is the most emotional of the scandals and we will deal with it as the program progresses this evening. but will it have the most impact? let's ask juan williams and jay sekulow. next week he will be filing lawsuits against the irs on behalf of several tea party organizations alleging what, jordan? welcome, gentlemen. >> thanks, geraldo. >> what are you going to be alleging 12346789. alleg? >> currently 17 of the 27 ready to file lawsuits here likely in washington, d.c. federal suits. the first the clients that have still not gotten an answer from

the irs and there is a federal mechanism at law not monetary damages for those. is an issue, too. basically get a declaratory judgment and look at that. >> geraldo: that they are tax exempt, is that it? >> that the irs has either targeted them in the past unfairly for those who may have been already approved but now we know the apollgy the reason why some were waiting two and a half three years for approve trautwig because of the targeted scheme. and then to declare that the irs arenac countied inappropriately. it moats by the court that you have been treated unfairly. targeted. viewpoint discrimination has occurred. that is the first count. the second will be he damage and there are federal provisions that allow for this and also supreme court cases that have kind of set forth the standard of how to move forward because some of the clients

they hired accountants to do this and didn't get donations and can document that. i expect that we will have more than 17 clients before we file this upcoming week. >> geraldo: and as you sit there tonight, jordan, are you convinced that the wrong doers were inside the irs or do you fear, do you expect, do you allege white house involvement? >> well, that won't really be part of our legal challenge. but you as we have seen throughout this investigation it all started for us when it was leaked by the head of the tax exempt organizations lois lerner at the aba meeting where she got the preset question and said it was just sense national. here we have letters not just from cincinnati but washington, d.c. at irs head quarters and two different offices in california. we knew then they weren't fell the full truth and the whole truth and then when the inspector general reports starting comingous this was highly coordinated and they

were notified and didn't make the changes they should have and it still hasn't been fixed. we will let congress do that side. we will focus on representing our clients. wouldn't be surprised if this goes higher than lois lerner. >> geraldo: juan, what to you think? goes as high as steve miller who resigned or the same question is the white house in on this? is this a huge scandal beyond the irs? what are you thinking, juan? >> the latest rerealation is that some treasury officials were informed about this in advance. treasury obviously takes you closer to the white house, geraldo and we don't know exactly whether or not then there is another are step in the progression with treasury informing white house officials. what we know so far is that the president's lawyer had some information about this inquiry as to what was going on at the irs. she apparently did not inform

any one else including the president until she learned that there was an inspector general's investigation taking place. and that seems to then have set off alarms at the white house. that is as far as we know and as you know the president said he only became aware of it at the time that he was told about the inspector general's report being forthcoming. >> one thing, geraldo. one part to that. a legalized answer which was and the president is a lawyer when was asked most recently in the rose garden when it was raining did he know about this targeting. he didn't say just absolutely know norman schwarzkopf. he saino. he said i didn't know what the inspector general's report. maybe he could correct that and come out with a straight no. until he does that it raises other attorney's suspicions because it wasn't a straight denial. >> geraldo: this president seems so disengaged a buy

bystander, playing golf today. like nemo fiddling when rome burns. >> i don't think this is anywhere are near rome burning. this is where republicans will get in trouble is overplaying their hands. the change in poll numbers. zero. president obama remains a popular president. for all of the churning and talk about rome burning politically it has been a nonstarter all of these scandals. let me come back to the irs thing. people are trying to parse what the president said and didn't say. he said he didn't know he about it until the inspector general. >> he said he didn't know about the report. very different. >> no evidence when people who are i guess looking for are conspiracies. >> not an answer you give unless you prepared it. >> geraldo: we have to leave it there. very interesting. thank you so much. >> your' welcome, geraldo. >> geraldo: up next, a benghazi whistle blower you have not

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common criminals released from prison after ghadaffi was everton. how we came to rely on them as security for our state department personal seems terrible judgment? the decision to rely on militias to keep our people safe in libya was ob rejustice scalialy a terrible idea gets worse. as craig new exclusively reports the state department also cut back on security that was already in place, our people. meet a fourth benghazi whistle blower. >> reporter: when you heard about ambassador stevens being killed, what were your thoughts? >> my first feelings were anger. thoughts, i was upset and angry because i felt like the adversaries we were facing got a jump on us. >> reporter: 55-year-old former

green beret lieutenant colonel andrew wood is really the first of the benghazi whistle brothers. as commander of site security in libya he led 16 special operators charged with providing protection for ambassador christopher stevens. the team was scheduled to accompany the ambassador on a trip to benghazi originally scheduled for june. when the trip was postponed colonel woods and his team who rotated out of libya despite repeated requests which the colonel and the ambassador that the team stay on because the threat level kept escalate. >> reporter: you were there. were there signs? signals? anything we could have done to prevent? >> i watched the accomplish come under several attacks in the month of june and we also had threats made to us both in tripoli and in benghazi. in benghazi there was this target list that occurred. posted on facebook threatening to kill americans. bomb on the fence at the american embassy. the red cross was attacked a

number of times. those were the warnings and then telewere a prelude to a direct attack. the red cross read those signs and departed benghazi. >> reporter: when you were in libya, were you aware of ambassador stevens asking for more security? >> yes. because after i made that pronouncement in june i was able to tell him and in the country team meeting we were going to be attacked and we were going to be attacked in benghazi as it was stated on the target list. it was the last thing remaining. it was a matter of time before they pulled it off. >> reporter: colonel wood and eric nordstrom saw the signs of growing peril as the ambassador repeatedly asked for help? >> we pursued the requests for security. again, me and eric watched the things be turned down again and again and then began to withdraw what they had there in libya. >> reporter: despite the colonel's dire warnings, the security team in libya was gutted, cut from 34 security

personnel down to just 8, handling diplomatic protection for the vast and troubled country. when ambassador stevens asked for more security, he was told? >> he was told no. he was told normalize. normalize. normalize. we fought that battle with state department main and d.c. they did not see the world as it was, especially in libya. >> reporter: a former security officer referred to a list of 230 security incidents in libya that happened between june 2011 and july 2012 writeing that "the incidents create a clear picture that the environment in libya was fragile at best and could degrade quickly." do you know as a fact as a former security officer in libya that there were islamists, that there were terrorists, that there was al-qaeda operating in libya that would possibly target americans? >> absolutely. one reason i was there was to

pursue those adversaries in country. i was working in counter terrorism to visionualize if you will -- visualize if you will my counterpart working for al-qaeda and doing the same thing. they were out there developing libyans to do these kind of strikes on libyan government to destablize them. >> reporter: why in the world then would ambassador rice go out there and say that this was because of some youtube movie? >> those statements to me indicated there was confusion, bad decisions being made at the highest levels. >> reporter: in emotional testimony deputy chief of mission gregory hicks the diplomat left in charge of libya when ambassador stevens was killed told the committee. >> the youtube video was a nonevent in libya. >> reporter: what must it have been like to call for help begging for help and none comes? >> very eck as per rating. it will be i'm sure the most

traumatic stress you mattic thing he would ever go through. >> reporter: people saying there were no military assets and we couldn't respond and wouldn't have got lennyway. what do you think? >> i find that very, very, very hard to believe. there was a number of assets available and a number of things that could be done. we coached the libyans to decrease and deescalate fighting within the own border towns. coached them to fly aircraft at a low altitude over. so fighting to dissipate the fighting and they did it and it works. why we didn't call upon them for example, call upon another country to fly an aircraft in there. all those things come into my mind as to where were all of the forces on the 11th anniversary of 9/11. >> reporter: do you blame the presort secretary of state? >> i don't know where the blame lies. there is a problem as we have seen evidence. we don't lose ambassadors like this. it is not anormal thing to have happen. it hasn't happened in 30 years.

>> reporter: like most of our friends in the military colonel wood understands how hard it would have been to carry out a real-time rescue of embattled personnel in benghazi but wishes we had at least tried. what he knows for sure is that that -- it is a request he and the ambassador made to keep the security detachment in country were granted this tragedy would have had a happier ending. >> geraldo: up next, a former justice department official who believes the attorney general believes the attorney general k[ musick ] i knew there were a lot of tech jobs available out there. i knew devry university would give me the skills that i needed to make one of those tech jobs mine. we teach cutting-edge engineering technology, computer information systems, networking and communications management -- the things that our students need to know in the world today. our country needs more college grads to help fill all the open technology jobs. to help meet that need, here at devry university, we're offering $4 million dollars in tech scholarships for qualified new students. learn more at devry.edu.

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the decision to issue this subpoena was made by the people who are presently involved in the case and matters being supervised by the deputy attorney general.

i am not familiar with the reasons why the subpoena was constructed in the way that it was because i'm simply not a part of the case. >> wherever you stand on the scandal trifecta, what's striking is how little the attorney general and the president say they knew about what was going on. jay christian adams got hired during the george w. bush administration, he stayed on, had his problems concerning the new black panther party, not relevant to this discussion perhaps. as he sits there tonight, he has doubts about what they knew, when they knew it. mr. adams, welcome. let's take the a.p. subpoenas first or the a.p. leak probe first, the attorney general claiming that he just doesn't know about the subpoenas to the associated press. what do you think? >> it's very peculiar, geraldo, because there are very clear d.o.j. guidelines on issuing

subpoenas to the press. i should know because i did one when i was there. it's one of the most sensitive and careful things you have to do. ultimately the attorney general is the one solely responsible for being in charge of this process. it literally says the attorney general has to personally approve. so it doesn't ring true he wouldn't know anything about this because he's supposed to. >> are you a former dncht o.j. relatively high ranking person, are you saying the boss, the attorney general is lying? >> he's either lying or he abdicated his responsibility under clear department of justice guidelines. the reason, geraldo, is because it's such a sensitive thing when the power of the federal government is intruding and subpoenaing the records of a press organization, you have to follow preestablished guidelines. in the case of the a.p., they just threw them out the window.

>> what do you think they were doing, though? we know what the leak is now. it wasn't cosmic. it was about what a cia op in yemen, they took the guy out, maybe they jumped the gun a day or two, but what was the obama administration -- what was their motive? were they trying to intimidate the press? i thought the presses their lap dog. that's what the right is always saying. what's going on here? >> the net was so broad. it was capturing all kinds of things, e-mails, phone calls, phone records. they were collecting information unfortunately that went way beyond this leak. they were collecting information about other matters where people were talking to the associated press. what the a.p. was thinking about, who their contacts were throughout the government. so unfortunately when you cast a net that's too big, you get a lot of stuff you didn't mean to catch, where in this case they did mean to catch it. >> so give me your theory. i'm not asking you to be an expert witness in a sense, but

why intimidate the associated press when the associated press, the allegation goes, is in your corner instinctively anyway? >> i think, geraldo, what you have here is in this administration, you have people who are desensitized to federal power, where they don't understand the deep responsibility they have. they hear their president talking about taking it out on their enemies. you have a government that has simply grown bigger and faster than any before it and they do things they shouldn't be doing because it's just part of the culture. unfortunately i think that's what happened here. >> can you apply what you just suggested to the irs scandal? >> apply it in spades. here you have a situation where the government is doing things that nobody could even dream about they would be doing, where they're asking people what books they read, what their prayers say. they did it to some of my clients. i knew about this -- letters two years ago. it's an absolute disgrace. the federal government should

never be looking into these sorts of things. >> and so that's just your view on this in terms of principle but a bad leak could be harmful, couldn't it? i mean, i don't know that this particularly went to the heart of national security, but you just don't want the administration leaking national security secret stuff, do you? >> of course not. and that's why you should have investigations when classified ffgs is leaked. but this goes back to those d.o.j. guidelines i talked about. you do the least restrictive means possible. that's in the code, in the regulations. the other things that the rules require is you attempt to negotiate a resolution. and that's what i did in my situation with a major newspaper in the country. you attempt to resolve it without this insanely broad, intrusive investigation into the

a.p. reporters. >> you think the sweetheart relationship between the obama administration and the mainstream media, is that now finished? >> we'll see. they go way back so they may reconcile. >> j. christian adams, thanks. appreciate it. >> take care. bye-bye. >> if obama administration officials were attempting to intimidate the press or if they knew ben ghazi was a terror attack, watch what gets said on my radio show for the

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